[Sticky] NVidia is killing off mPCIe/NGFF.M2 eGPUs : error 43 with 372.90 or newer driver  

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nando4
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December 1, 2016 10:22 am  

here ◄  workaround #1: The definitive fix for error 43 on non-hotplug interfaces with GTX10xx cards by  GynTh0r, inxftw, IgorGIV, shoes

hereworkaround #2: enable PCIe port hot plug using UEFI variables to toggle hidden BIOS settings by xRay

 

 


UPDATE #1: This problem is specific to the GTX10xx series. GTX9xx and older cards are reportedly not be affected.
Worst are GTX1050 and some new GTX1060 cards that are not supported on the 372.70 downgrade workaround driver solution.

 

The Problem

 NVidia's driver 372.90 and newer is checking if the eGPU hosting port/bridge locked hotplug bit is enabled. If not, the driver fails to initialize with error 43.  Below we show how you can check if your mPCIe/NGFF.M2 interface is affected, look at AMD option and suggest the best eGPU interface to invest in.

Those affected are have these two workaround solutions:

1. revert back to 372.70 and (for the time being) , bypass driver version checking in games like BF1.

2. remove all current NVidia drivers, load 368.81 then do a 378.57 (not 'clean') install. Details as provided by @IgorGIV here

 

How to check if the candidate eGPU port is hotplug enabled?

Example below: a Dell E6540 (that I'm currently using). I find the wifi card to identify the mPCIe port that could host an eGPU. Then I click the hosting PCIe bridge to check if hotplugging support is enabled.

 
hotplug check

 

 Can I enable the hotplug bit?

 Not (usually). The PCIe port hotplug bits are read and write-once (R/WO), so we can't change them after the BIOS has set them as shown from Intel's datasheet extract below. I've also confirmed these are write-once by attempting PCI writes to the register and seeing it doesn't change. You either need a factory/hacked BIOS with hotplug enabling settings or identify of UEFI variables that can be altered using a special grub2 bootloader.

 

 Can't I just use an AMD card instead?

 Yes, but AMD has no NVIdia Optimus internal LCD acceleration and I found it's DX11/DX10 performance to be inferior over a narrow x1 interface. The poor features and performance makes you wonder why bother? I'd be inclined to build a desktop PC instead.

 

What eGPU interface should I invest in instead?

 Thunderbolt 3. The US$268 AKiTiO Node making this a somewhat financially viable interface. See https://egpu.io/external-gpu-buyers-guide-2017/#tb3-enclosures

 

 What if TB3 is too expensive? I live in a poor country.

Look for older expresscard 2.0 systems. The BIOS should set that port as hotplug enabled as is defined by PCI SIG to be a hotpluggable interface. See details about them at https://egpu.io/forums/pc-setup/expresscard-2-0-egpu-interface-pros-cons-and-a-candidate-notebook-list/

 

Otherwise you can still go with mPCIe/NGFF.M2, but be aware that future games will need new driver capabilities. Likely you've got about 1-2 years of current gaming use then.

 

2013 15" Dell Latitude E6540 HD8790M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + macOS 10.13.5 & Win10
2013 15" HP ZBook 15 K610M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + Win10
--
eGPU Port Bandwidth Reference TableeGPU Setup 1.35


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Yukikaze
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December 1, 2016 6:34 pm  

I wonder if the check is intentional, or is that something added inadvertently. I think the latter is more likely, since nVidia does not gain much (if anything, they might lose sales) from blocking such eGPU use.

As for Expresscard, I know that some of the later Lenovos still have Expresscard slots (often occupied by the removable card reader). The T540 should have this port, for example, and it is just one generation back on the Lenovo product list.

Finally, a good laptop alternative for eGPU use is the Lenovo T430s. The i7 version (without an nVidia GPU, and only that model, so be careful when you look for them - All the other models have a mini-DisplayPort instead of the Thunderbolt port) has a Thunderbolt chip and it is (very) easy to get eGPU working on that laptop. Couple that with a DIY setup based on the ThunderTek/PX (140$) and you can have a nice setup for quite cheap. I picked up a T430s for 136$ on ebay to replace my dead NUC, which is an absolute steal for a lightweight, Thunderbolt-capable, 2.9Ghz i7-3520M based laptop with 8GB of RAM.

My eGPU Zoo - Link to my Implementations.
Want to output 4K@60Hz out of an old system on the cheap? Read here.
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HWfreak
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December 1, 2016 7:39 pm  

T430s with i7 in Poland cost about 300$ but it is interesting option. My Vostro 3460 has "Not-capable" hot plug and i can't do anything with this on bios :/


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survfate
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December 2, 2016 7:58 am  

Lucky I have dumped my bios and was able to mod it, bad news for people who stuck with unmoddable bios 🙁

2012 15" Asus K55VJ GT635M i5-3210M + GTX1050Ti@4Gbps-mPCIe2 (EXP GDC 8.4d) + Win10 // Hot-Plug BIOS mod


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HWfreak
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December 2, 2016 9:21 am  

@survfate what laptop you have?

Also, anyone have idea to workaround about this hot plug?


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nando4
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December 2, 2016 10:32 am  
Posted by: HWfreak

 

@survfate what laptop you have?

Also, anyone have idea to workaround about this hot plug?

   

The hot plug bit is write-once. Has to be done by the BIOS. So would need a BIOS setting, modded bios or UEFI variable to set that bit.

It would serve NVidias interests to ceasing mPCIe/NGFF.M2 eGPUs from an RMA POV. The hosting hacky eGPU adapters leaving the video card exposed to environmental and user  damage.  Damaged cards cost NVidia replacement costs.

Worth noting too the latest GTX1050 starts at driver 375.63. So no official 372.70 driver downgrade workaround solution for that series.

2013 15" Dell Latitude E6540 HD8790M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + macOS 10.13.5 & Win10
2013 15" HP ZBook 15 K610M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + Win10
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eGPU Port Bandwidth Reference TableeGPU Setup 1.35


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HWfreak
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December 2, 2016 11:07 am  

Strange... Driver 372.54 was released 2016-08-30 and PL community don't talking about this bug... Only way to cheat this "feature" is buy GTX1060,70 and 80 or something from GTX9xx gen... I must make research about eGPU and ATI. Or learn how to mod BIOSes 😀

 


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HWfreak
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December 5, 2016 12:33 pm  

Polish user juliano reports that y580 running on driver 376.09. Meybe it is 372.90 is broken? Can someone test other drivers?


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nando4
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December 6, 2016 5:30 am  
Posted by: HWfreak

 

Polish user juliano reports that y580 running on driver 376.09. Meybe it is 372.90 is broken? Can someone test other drivers?

   

Did Juliano check if his eGPU hosting PCIe port has hotplugging disabled as shown in the first post? If it's enabled then there will be no issues with 372.90 or newer.

2013 15" Dell Latitude E6540 HD8790M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + macOS 10.13.5 & Win10
2013 15" HP ZBook 15 K610M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + Win10
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eGPU Port Bandwidth Reference TableeGPU Setup 1.35


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Cacada
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December 7, 2016 1:55 pm  

I looked into this, it seems that user posted a screenshot and hotplug is not enabled in bios for Y580 

Same as for the Y480 model 

A youtuber advised you can uninstall using DDU, reinstall old driver and then upgrade and it works well. 

 

May just be for the lenovo models though? 


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nando4
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December 7, 2016 2:35 pm  
Posted by: Cacada

 

I looked into this, it seems that user posted a screenshot and hotplug is not enabled in bios for Y580 

Same as for the Y480 model 

A youtuber advised you can uninstall using DDU, reinstall old driver and then upgrade and it works well. 

 

May just be for the lenovo models though? 

   

Did the Y480/Y580 users have problems specifically with 372.90? That's when the problems started. @hwfreak reports a couple of screens up a Polish Y580 user running 376.09 without problem. A reddit NGFF.M2 NUC user also posting working screenshots with 376.09 + Win8.1.

2013 15" Dell Latitude E6540 HD8790M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + macOS 10.13.5 & Win10
2013 15" HP ZBook 15 K610M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + Win10
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eGPU Port Bandwidth Reference TableeGPU Setup 1.35


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HWfreak
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December 9, 2016 7:00 pm  

Here is screen from Lenovo Y580 with i7-3630QM, dGPU GTX660M and Windows 8.1 Pro. eGPU GTX 1060 6GB

https://scr.hu/rqOegg

eGPU works on 372.90 and 376.19 drivers :/

Maybe Windows 10 is screwed?

 


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Cacada
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December 11, 2016 6:52 pm  

I was thinking the same as hwfreak. Only success stories I've seen were not on w10


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nando4
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December 12, 2016 3:36 am  

HWFreak has advise in offline correspondence that he'll be testing across different machines and OS to try to isolate this issue further. Reports suggesting Lenovo Y510P/Y480/Y580 are immune to this error 43 problem.

Posted by: Cacada

 

I was thinking the same as hwfreak. Only success stories I've seen were not on w10

   

2013 15" Dell Latitude E6540 HD8790M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + macOS 10.13.5 & Win10
2013 15" HP ZBook 15 K610M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + Win10
--
eGPU Port Bandwidth Reference TableeGPU Setup 1.35


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survfate
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December 13, 2016 4:12 am  
Posted by: HWfreak

 

Here is screen from Lenovo Y580 with i7-3630QM, dGPU GTX660M and Windows 8.1 Pro. eGPU GTX 1060 6GB

https://scr.hu/rqOegg

eGPU works on 372.90 and 376.19 drivers :/

Maybe Windows 10 is screwed?

 

   

Hey man what is the Windows 10 build version you using in this test?

2012 15" Asus K55VJ GT635M i5-3210M + GTX1050Ti@4Gbps-mPCIe2 (EXP GDC 8.4d) + Win10 // Hot-Plug BIOS mod


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HWfreak
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December 13, 2016 8:30 am  

It was not my laptop. When new cable for EXP GDC will arrived i will test with newest Win10 and newest Win8.1.


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taby448
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December 17, 2016 7:57 am  

I have the lenovo y40-70 w/ beast v8 NGFF and i am gonna receive my cable in the mail in a few days. I'll test latest drivers w/ gtx 660 on windows 10

Lenovo y40-70

intel core i7 4510, 8gb, AMD R9 M275X

I got an egpu because my radeon card died in a tragic death of a pop and a crackle. Memory killed itself hard. .2gb effective? ill check my bios again for hotplugging tho not sure if it can its the basic lenovo, shitty, bios.


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taby448
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December 24, 2016 3:59 am  

Update, Still isn't here :/ From what it seems like Nvidia Fixed the issue according to some people. I saw the 1050 run with a ngff which uses at oldest one of the "blacklisted" drivers on a you-tube video 


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Third_Avenue
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December 31, 2016 8:04 pm  

I have an eGPU setup with a T460p Thinkpad and a GTX 560 and 1060. The NGFF.M2 slot I use is not hotplug enabled. However, the GTX 560 works perfectly fine with the new 376.33 driver, but the GTX 1060 gives error 43 with the same driver, and thus requires a rollback to 372.70 to work. Can anyone with a larger Nvidia graphics card collection find out where between the 560 and the 1060 cards drivers past 372.70 start to cause problems?


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nando4
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Plastixx
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December 31, 2016 8:28 pm  
Posted by: Third_Avenue

 

I have an eGPU setup with a T460p Thinkpad and a GTX 560 and 1060. The NGFF.M2 slot I use is not hotplug enabled. However, the GTX 560 works perfectly fine with the new 376.33 driver, but the GTX 1060 gives error 43 with the same driver, and thus requires a rollback to 372.70 to work. Can anyone with a larger Nvidia graphics card collection find out where between the 560 and the 1060 cards drivers past 372.70 start to cause problems?

   

Its just 10-series cards that have problems. 376.33 is working fine with my 960.

 

Try installing 375.63 without uninstalling 372.70.


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Third_Avenue
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January 1, 2017 3:19 am  

@Plastixx, I just tried this, gave me an error 43. Ah well.

@nando4, you mentioned in the original post that AMD cards do less than Nvidia when using a single lane. How much worse is it? I might end up returning my 1060 and buying an rx 480 if I (or anyone else) can't find a long-term solution to this driver issue.


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nando4
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January 3, 2017 3:19 pm  

I'd advise getting a GTX9xx series instead of an AMD card. They've been reported as not having this error 43 issue with newer drivers. NVidia outperforming AMD on x1 links AND offering Optimus to accelerate the internal LCD if have an active Intel HD iGPU. Compelling reasons to stick with NVidia on narrow x1 links.

Posted by: Third_Avenue

 

@Plastixx, I just tried this, gave me an error 43. Ah well.

@nando4, you mentioned in the original post that AMD cards do less than Nvidia when using a single lane. How much worse is it? I might end up returning my 1060 and buying an rx 480 if I (or anyone else) can't find a long-term solution to this driver issue.

   

2013 15" Dell Latitude E6540 HD8790M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + macOS 10.13.5 & Win10
2013 15" HP ZBook 15 K610M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + Win10
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eGPU Port Bandwidth Reference TableeGPU Setup 1.35


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z_y
 z_y
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January 5, 2017 9:27 pm  

hi,

i have a thinkpad x220 and i am using pe4c v3.0 expresscard with gtx1060.

372.70 working fine with internal LCD over optimus, but newer drivers gives error43.

notebook has modded bios and i activated hotplug enable option on all pci port.

so, i am not sure whether this problem is related with hotplug issue...

 


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velitacast
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January 8, 2017 12:27 am  

TL;DR: For Expresscard like in my HP 8760W, NVIDIA Driver Version 375.70 is the latest version that will allow an NVIDIA 10xx series eGPU to run without error 43.  Reason: Undetermined 

I'm having a similar issue and I found a way to get 372.90 (or newer) working.  I'm also using a GTX1060 (6GB Mini from ZOTAC)  I'm going to keep trying newer and newer ones and I'll keep updating here, but here's what I did:

  1. Use display driver uninstaller to delete all NVIDIA related video drivers, restart
  2. Install 372.90 (or newer) using NVIDIA installer, restart
  3. eGPU should work without Error 43 on boot, if not, try step 4
  4. Device Manager > Display Adapters and find a device that's called Standard VGA or similar, right click and "Update Driver" > "Browse" > "Let Me Pick" > "Have Disk" > "Browse" and browse to wherever you extracted the NVIDIA drivers (for me C:\NVIDIA\DisplayDriver\372.90\Win8_Win7_64\International\Display.Driver\nv_desktop_ref4i.inf), Open > OK > Choose your card's name (should be only one) and click next.  It should install, your screen should go blank for a bit and then the eGPU should kick on.

Versions Tested (* denotes verified working, ! denotes error 43 result): 372.70*, 372,90*, 373.06*, 375.63*, 375.70*, 375.95!, 376.09!

Find old NVIDIA drivers here

2011 HP EliteBook 8760w+8560w + GTX1060-6GB@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.4b) + Win10


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Cacada
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January 22, 2017 6:07 pm  

Any news from testing @HWfreak ?


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James2406
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January 24, 2017 1:54 am  
  • Can confirm gtx 1070 pe4c v3.0 via express card on a Thinkpad W530 i7-3740qm with Intel 4000 and the Nvidia Quadro K2000m works but only with the rollback 372.70 driver. I will look around for the hotplug option or listing in the bios and online. I'll also try to move up drivers one by one to see what happens. I would be up for possibly a hacked/modded bios to get around this issue if possible. 

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nando4
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January 24, 2017 2:06 am  
Posted by: James2406

 

  • Can confirm gtx 1070 pe4c v3.0 via express card on a Thinkpad W530 i7-3740qm with Intel 4000 and the Nvidia Quadro K2000m works but only with the rollback 372.70 driver. I will look around for the hotplug option or listing in the bios and online. I'll also try to move up drivers one by one to see what happens. I would be up for possibly a hacked/modded bios to get around this issue if possible. 

   

James, the expresscard interface is specced as being hotpluggable. Did you check whether  your eGPU hosting PCIe port (expresscard) is already hotplug enabled like shown on the opening post? Two posts up, @Velitacast managed to use 375.70 on his expresscard equipped HP 8760W.

2013 15" Dell Latitude E6540 HD8790M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + macOS 10.13.5 & Win10
2013 15" HP ZBook 15 K610M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + Win10
--
eGPU Port Bandwidth Reference TableeGPU Setup 1.35


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L502X
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January 29, 2017 2:53 pm  

So is this driver issue specific to Windows 10? Has anyone tried on Windows 7/8?


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BeautyRazor
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February 2, 2017 9:26 am  

I cant install driver older than 375.95, because this isn't contains my dev and subsys ids. But newer drivers get error 43. Please help me to install older drivers...


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nando4
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February 2, 2017 9:46 am  
Posted by: BeautyRazor

 

I cant install driver older than 375.95, because this isn't contains my dev and subsys ids. But newer drivers get error 43. Please help me to install older drivers...

   

See Plastixx' attempt at adding a new card to be supported by the 372.70 driver at https://egpu.io/forums/pc-setup/i-got-gtx-1050-ti-to-work-with-372-70-sort-of/

2013 15" Dell Latitude E6540 HD8790M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + macOS 10.13.5 & Win10
2013 15" HP ZBook 15 K610M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + Win10
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eGPU Port Bandwidth Reference TableeGPU Setup 1.35


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Sirios
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February 5, 2017 2:05 pm  
Posted by: z_y

 

hi,

i have a thinkpad x220 and i am using pe4c v3.0 expresscard with gtx1060.

372.70 working fine with internal LCD over optimus, but newer drivers gives error43.

notebook has modded bios and i activated hotplug enable option on all pci port.

so, i am not sure whether this problem is related with hotplug issue...

 

   

Hey! I have eGPU set-up with x220 too! What OS is installed on your system?

Thanks

X220, IPS, Intel Core i7-2620m, 16 gb, Samsung 840 pro 256 gb, eGPU + EVGA FTW GTX1080.


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DavidC
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February 19, 2017 1:00 am  
Posted by: nando4

 

 UPDATE: This problem is specific to the GTX10xx series. GTX9xx and older cards are reportedly not be affected.
Worst are GTX1050 and some new GTX1060 cards that are not supported on the 372.70 downgrade workaround driver solution.

 

Otherwise you can still go with mPCIe/NGFF.M2, but be aware that future games will need new driver capabilities. Likely you've got about 1-2 years of current gaming use then.

 

   

Hi Nando4.  Thanks for the info.  I have been reading up on this for couple weeks now since running into the same problem with a 1060 6G card with a error 43.  So is the conclusion still remains that the 10xx cards (any 10xx card) with mPCIe and non-hotplug setup will only work with 372.70 and older driver?  Mine is working in Wins 8.1 with 372.70 but not newer driver.

I am trying to decide if I should stay with this setup or return the card and get a 980 TI for better future prove.  You mentioned without the capabilities of using new driver, this setup may only be viable for a year or two.  TIA.


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nando4
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February 19, 2017 5:22 am  

DavidC, unfortunately the conclusion remains the same. GTX10xx and drivers 372.90 and thereafter cause error 43 on non-hotpluggable mPCIe/M2 interfaces. GTX9xx and older or AMD cards are the workaround to avoid being stuck on the NVidia 372.70 driver with a GTX10xx card.

2013 15" Dell Latitude E6540 HD8790M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + macOS 10.13.5 & Win10
2013 15" HP ZBook 15 K610M + RX580@4Gbps-EC2 (EXP GDC 8.x) + Win10
--
eGPU Port Bandwidth Reference TableeGPU Setup 1.35


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DavidC
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February 19, 2017 1:59 pm  

nando4, thanks a lot for the reply.  I guess another option is to mod the hotplug bit in the bios.  I have a Lenovo G510 running Win 8.1.  Do you know if modding the bios is reversible assuming I made a backup prior in case something goes wrong?  I will do more research myself but in general how difficult is it to mod the bios?  Thanks.


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carage
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February 19, 2017 3:29 pm  

I have a ThinkPad W520 connected to a GTX 1080 via EXP GDC Beast ExpressCard,

375.63 has been great for me, it is even much more reliable than any of the 372 and earlier series.

Things have been great until this morning when I noticed the external monitor no longer has a signal,

as I suspected, Windows 10 decided to sneakily update the driver to 376.53 WHQL in the middle of the night.

I reinstalled 375.70 over it and followed the instructions to turn off automatic driver updates in the control panel,

but a few hours later I found Windows 10 did it again. 

Is there anyway to tell Windows 10 not to mess with a particular set of drivers permanently?

I don't really want to turn off automatic driver updates/installation for all devices as I find the feature to be pretty convenient,

but I also hate to reinstall display drivers every morning when I wake up or come back home after work. 

 

Additionally, my patience is wearing thin on this.  As nVidia is apparently ignoring those of us on "legacy connections",

I might as well get a ThinkPad P50 and join the TB3 crowd or build a desktop and ditch the whole EGPU scene altogether.


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