late-2016 15" MacBook Pro RP450 + GTX1080Ti@32Gbps-TB3 (Mantiz Venus) + macOS10.12.4 [theitsage]^  

 

theitsage
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April 12, 2017 2:38 am  

The first week of April has been insanely great for Mac users. Apple apologized that its Late 2013 Mac Pro trashcan failed to meet users’ needs. It vowed to completely redesign its next Mac Pro to make up with its core user base, the creative professionals. Two days later, Nvidia announced a beast of a graphics card, the GTX Titan Xp. It subtly dropped the news Pascal drivers for macOS would arrive within a week to support this new GPU and a whole host of GTX 10 series graphics cards.

We prepped our Mantiz Venus Thunderbolt 3 external GPU enclosure with a GTX 1080 Ti then hooked it up to a Late 2016 15″ MacBook Pro. Everything was ready to go pending the web drivers from Nvidia. April 11, 2017 marked an 11-month wait for Pascal driver support in macOS since the GTX 1080 release on May 27, 2016. This was a much longer delay than the previous seven-month wait for Maxwell drivers. All was forgiven though. Nvidia web drivers 378.05.05.05f01 are here, and they work with some visual glitches with Goalque’s automate-eGPU script to enable GTX 10 series eGPU support in macOS. This is the beta version of the drivers and hopefully these glitches will be remedied by the time the Pascal drivers are finalized.

There have been many questions and concerns about bottlenecking on eGPU implementations. Before we discuss the CPU performance, let’s assess the full path the GPU travels via the external enclosure to accelerate your ultrabook. This is a typical channel for how the external GPU communicates with the CPU:

GPU « » External Enclosure « » Thunderbolt cable « » Computer « » PCH « » CPU

 

Maximising TB3 eGPU performance: TB3-CPU vs TB3-PCH, how many PCIe lanes are attached?

The past five months have taught us there are frustrations in selecting the right components for your eGPU build to get the most performance. Some notable issues we’ve discovered include the 2x PCIe lane cripple with the majority of the Dell XPS line, the TI83 enclosures’ firmware Host-to-Device half-speed limit and Intel’s Thunderbolt 3 fine print (pg6) which states Thunderbolt “DATA” (i.e., PCIe traffic) is throttled down to 22Gbps. Our reports have prompted Dell to clarify its XPS laptops PCIe lanes and have encouraged external GPU manufacturers to push Intel for firmware updates.

To get the most out of an eGPU setup, you should start with a computer that is a good Thunderbolt 3 host. From the limited resources we’ve gathered to date, the Late 2016 15″ MacBook Pro is currently the best host for external GPU implementation. We found Apple attached the PCIe lanes directly to the quad-core i7 CPU in the newest 15″ MacBook Pro laptops.

This is unlike the majority of Thunderbolt 3 laptops which route the PCIe lanes through the PCH. The disadvantage of having the Thunderbolt connection through the PCH is that the PCH shares bandwidth with other internal components (e.g., PCIe flash storage, network cards, USB ports) and potentially limits the eGPU performance. Nando prepared this table explaining max bandwidth for eGPU usage on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro.

late-2016 15″ Macbook Pro late-2016 13″ Macbook Pro Touch Bar

# of active eGPUs : bandwidth per eGPU

1: 22Gbps
2: 22Gbps/16Gbps  (on alternate/same side)
3: 22Gbps on side with single eGPU, 16Gbps on side with dual eGPUs
4: 16Gbps

 

# of active eGPUs : bandwidth per eGPU

1: 22Gbps/16Gbps (left/right) minus other PCH devices overhead
2: 16Gbps  (on alternate sides or left side only) minus other PCH devices overhead
2: 8Gbps (right side only)  minus other PCH devices overhead 
3: b/w 8Gbps-16Gbps depending on ports used minus other PCH devices overhead
4: 8Gbps  minus other PCH devices overhead

 

 

GTX 1080 Ti Performance Testing

We wanted to test the GTX 1080 Ti Thunderbolt 3 eGPU with the Late 2016 15″ MacBook Pro to present a best-case scenario performance wise. We are using an AKiTiO Node and a Mantiz Venus TB3 external GPU enclosure for these tests. We also have a full comparison on different external enclosures in our eGPU buyer’s guide. The Unigine tests were run through the MacBook Pro’s internal display via the ghost HDMI adapter. Here are our initial findings:

Late 2016 15" MacBook ProLuxmark 3.1Valley 1.0Heaven 4.0
AMD Radeon Pro 450 + Intel HD 5305,822706360
AMD Radeon Pro 455 + Intel HD 5305,901798404
AMD Radeon Pro 460 + Intel HD 5306,056895495
Nvidia GeForce GTX 980 Ti TB3 eGPU22,6732,0261,177
Nvidia GeForce GTX 1080 Ti TB3 eGPU23,1722,3531,422
Nvidia GeForce GTX 1080 Ti TB3 eGPU external display23,1723,0312,640

 

It’s an exciting time for our eGPU community. Apple is beginning to take steps in the right direction to address the power and performance needs of its pro users. At the same time Nvidia is expanding the selection of graphics cards available for eGPU implementation on Macs.

Edited: 3 months  ago

Numerous implementation guides


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ficklepony
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April 12, 2017 3:00 pm  

I can not successfully install automate-eGPU.sh in 13″ MacBook Pro 2016 with AKiTio Node plus GTX1070. Did I do something wrong? Could you please write the steps for us? Thx a lot. 

Thunderbolt3


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theitsage
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April 12, 2017 4:06 pm  

What was the error you saw when you ran the automate-eGPU script? What does it look like in Graphics/Display?

The Firmware Version 21.1 for your Node may be causing a problem here. After the latest April firmware update, the Node reports 25.1. When and where did you acquire this AKiTiO Node?

Numerous implementation guides


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QuadX
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April 12, 2017 8:32 pm  

I have 15″ MBPtb with RP460 | Razer Core | GTX 1080. I did TB3 enabler and automate-eGPU script. It detected the GTX1080 and installed 378 webdriver. I reboot after running the script and it’s not detecting the GPU. What am I doing wrong?


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theitsage
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April 12, 2017 8:52 pm  

I don’t have experience with the Razer Node. The newest Nvidia web drivers are still glitchy. I’d recommend rebooting your MacBook Pro with the eGPU attached and see if it will eventually work.

Numerous implementation guides


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mac_editor
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April 13, 2017 4:34 pm  

Could you possibly post benchmarks while running on an external display via eGPU with the internal monitor disabled?

Mid-2014 15" MacBook Pro GT750M + RX480@16Gbps-TB2 (AKiTiO Node via TB3->TB2 adapter) + macOS & Win10
Purge-NVDA - Enable AMD eGPUs on NVDA Macs on High Sierra


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theitsage
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April 13, 2017 11:13 pm  

Updated with benchmarks through external display. I need to get a 4K display to test this setup at higher resolutions.

Numerous implementation guides


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mac_editor
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April 14, 2017 5:18 am  

Many many thanks for that! The improvements over the internal display-only setup are quite remarkable.

Mid-2014 15" MacBook Pro GT750M + RX480@16Gbps-TB2 (AKiTiO Node via TB3->TB2 adapter) + macOS & Win10
Purge-NVDA - Enable AMD eGPUs on NVDA Macs on High Sierra


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mac_editor
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April 14, 2017 5:20 am  

I would presume that you accelerated the internal display with a headless HDMI adapter?

Mid-2014 15" MacBook Pro GT750M + RX480@16Gbps-TB2 (AKiTiO Node via TB3->TB2 adapter) + macOS & Win10
Purge-NVDA - Enable AMD eGPUs on NVDA Macs on High Sierra


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enjoy
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April 14, 2017 9:31 pm  

Great setup again 🙂 Can you run heaven with the settings like in this results in Desktop PC for the performance drop thread? : 

Edited: 10 months  ago

ϟ AKiTiO Thunder2 + EVGA GTX 1060 6GB SC Gaming (macOS Sierra 10.12.4 and Windows 10)
 MacBook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Later 2013) 3.2GHz Quad Core Intel i7-4750HQ / 8 GB 1600 MHz DDR3 / 256GB SSD + 1TB
mini eGPUPCI Express vs. ThunderboltMac CAN gameGaming Laptops vs. MacBook Pro with eGPU


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theitsage
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April 14, 2017 10:10 pm  

I will install Windows in Boot Camp and run these tests soon.

Numerous implementation guides


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JonnieCache
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April 15, 2017 1:27 pm  

I have tried the same setup that you have here (except using an Akitio Node) and I can’t get numbers anywhere close to yours. On Heaven 1600×900 8XAA windowed Extreme with my 1080Ti, I got only 36 frames per second and a score of 906!

I tried uploading a screenshot of the results, but received that HTTP 500 error again. There is something wrong with the site, I think.

Edited: 10 months  ago

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ed_co
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April 21, 2017 9:13 am  

@theitsage, have you had the opportunity to try with the latest firmware into the Venus?? Cheers

mid-2017 Macbook Pro RP560 + MSI GTX1080Ti GAMING X@32Gbps-TB3 (Mantiz Venus) + macOS10.13.3 & Win10


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Wrn2x
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April 24, 2017 8:55 pm  

I’m using the same setup except a Razer Core instead of Akitio Node, but I can’t get macOS detects the eGPU, neither internal nor external displays. Could you specify the steps you take to make it work?


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Yukikaze
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April 24, 2017 8:57 pm  
Posted by: JonnieCache

 

I have tried the same setup that you have here (except using an Akitio Node) and I can’t get numbers anywhere close to yours. On Heaven 1600×900 8XAA windowed Extreme with my 1080Ti, I got only 36 frames per second and a score of 906!

I tried uploading a screenshot of the results, but received that HTTP 500 error again. There is something wrong with the site, I think.

   

That is pretty much the same result my T430s gets at the same settings with a 1050Ti as an eGPU over Thunderbolt1. I suspect your benchmark is running off the dGPU, not the eGPU.

Edited: 10 months  ago

"Dire Wolf II" - HP ZBook 15 G4: Core i7-7820HQ, 32GB, M1200 dGPU, R9 Fury@32Gbps-TB3 (Mantiz Venus) eGPU, HP Z27q (5K) + Dell P2715Q (4K)
"Timber Wolf" - HP Spectre x360: Core i7-8550U, 16GB, GTX1050Ti@16Gbps-TB3>TB2 (AKiTiO Thunder2), Dell U3011
"Stormcrow" - Lenovo T430s: Core i7-3520M, 8GB, GTX750Ti@10Gbps-TB1 (AKiTiO Thunder2) eGPU, Sony 4K TV
"Phoenix Hawk" - Intel NUC 33217CK: Core i3-3217U, 8GB, GTX670@4Gbps-mPCIe2 (PCE164P-N03) + Linux Mint 18.2 (64-bit)

"Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, and why. Then do it."- Robert A. Heinlein, "Time Enough for Love."


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footbags
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May 25, 2017 12:07 am  

Same with a 1080ti 🙁 Did you ever get it to work?


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BMW2017
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June 22, 2017 10:33 pm  

Mantiz Venus 02 + 2016 MacBook Pro 15″ + macOS Sierra + LG 38UC99

What exactly do I need to do to get this running when my Mantiz arrives? I understand that I don’t need to run the TB3 script, but I will have to run a different script? Thanks.


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peshay
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June 27, 2017 2:33 pm  

I just became my Mantiz Venus today and put in a MSI GTX 980ti Seahawk. It’s recognised by macOS, so driver installation and all this worked well. But maybe someone can help me with some issues:

– if I close my MacBook Pro, the internal screen stays active, while I actually want to work with the external screen only

– I am not sure how I can force for example StarCraft to run with this graphic card. While running it on my external display, the mouse was really laggy the higher I put the graphic settings. Maybe I should attach my USB directly to the MacBook? I also thought that such a big GPU could handle the extreme settings in Starcraft, but it’s actually pretty bad

– The Fan is pretty noisy, as it has an additional liquid cooling fan, I just put it in the case where it just had space, but I guess thats not really optimal. Any idea how I can optimise the setup to reduce the fan speed/noise?


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Eightarmedpet
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June 27, 2017 2:36 pm  

I can’t help with the other points but I have read that connecting peripherals to the USB ports on eGPUs often results in problems… (laggy, disconnection etc). I mostly read that reg the Razer Core so not sure about Mantiz but might be the same?

Edited: 8 months  ago

2017 13" MacBook Pro Touchbar + GTX1060@32Gbps-TB3 (AKiTiO Thunder3) + Win10
2017 13" MacBook Pro Touch Bar + GTX1070@32Gbps-TB3 (Sonnet Breakaway Box) + Win10


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kotlos
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June 27, 2017 3:07 pm  
Posted by: peshay

I just became my Mantiz Venus today and put in a MSI GTX 980ti Seahawk. It’s recognised by macOS, so driver installation and all this worked well. But maybe someone can help me with some issues:

– if I close my MacBook Pro, the internal screen stays active, while I actually want to work with the external screen only

– I am not sure how I can force for example StarCraft to run with this graphic card. While running it on my external display, the mouse was really laggy the higher I put the graphic settings. Maybe I should attach my USB directly to the MacBook? I also thought that such a big GPU could handle the extreme settings in Starcraft, but it’s actually pretty bad

– The Fan is pretty noisy, as it has an additional liquid cooling fan, I just put it in the case where it just had space, but I guess thats not really optimal. Any idea how I can optimise the setup to reduce the fan speed/noise?

I wouldn’t think that the Venus supports GPUs with liquid cooling. Maybe drill holes on the back cover where the SSD sits, and mount the radiator there if the tubes allow it. 


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lukicharms
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July 14, 2017 2:49 pm  

My internal display in MacOS is flickering on and off after successfully running the automate gpu script. My 2016 Macbook 15″ 455, recognizes the my GTX 1080Ti and external monitor is working. I noticed the internal display starts flickering on an off after about 3-5 min in. Another thing to note is that when I run the Heaven benchmark its runs on my external display, but with my AMD 455 iGPU instead. Im running MacOS Sierra 10.12.4 I also disabled csrutil.


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theitsage
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July 14, 2017 3:49 pm  

I noticed the screen flashes when I tried the GTX 1080 Ti back in April. I think it’s something related to the beta drivers.

Numerous implementation guides


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Mymantiz_John
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July 14, 2017 10:24 pm  
Posted by: Eightarmedpet

I can’t help with the other points but I have read that connecting peripherals to the USB ports on eGPUs often results in problems… (laggy, disconnection etc). I mostly read that reg the Razer Core so not sure about Mantiz but might be the same?

Mantiz Venus doesn’t have that issue Unless:

1. XPS 9350 Half bandwidth + H2D hunger gfx ( Such as r9 Fury stuff )

2. Logitech 2.4G wireless adapter Mouse + some metal enclosure Laptop ( Laptop TB3 Port EMI noise ) 

Besides these 2, everything works fine.

For Razer Case, it was previous unstable FW issue, there was a fix for that and the issue was gone.

Mantiz: ShopFacebookTwitter


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Mymantiz_John
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July 14, 2017 10:26 pm  
Posted by: peshay

I just became my Mantiz Venus today and put in a MSI GTX 980ti Seahawk. It’s recognised by macOS, so driver installation and all this worked well. But maybe someone can help me with some issues:

– if I close my MacBook Pro, the internal screen stays active, while I actually want to work with the external screen only

– I am not sure how I can force for example StarCraft to run with this graphic card. While running it on my external display, the mouse was really laggy the higher I put the graphic settings. Maybe I should attach my USB directly to the MacBook? I also thought that such a big GPU could handle the extreme settings in Starcraft, but it’s actually pretty bad

– The Fan is pretty noisy, as it has an additional liquid cooling fan, I just put it in the case where it just had space, but I guess thats not really optimal. Any idea how I can optimise the setup to reduce the fan speed/noise?

for the fan noise, please change it to first fan connector. now it is in the 2nd, count it from the left.

Mantiz: ShopFacebookTwitter


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Mymantiz_John
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July 14, 2017 10:27 pm  
Posted by: ed_co

@theitsage, have you had the opportunity to try with the latest firmware into the Venus?? Cheers

new FW is on the way, we will publish it soon.

Mantiz: ShopFacebookTwitter


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Rycco
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July 25, 2017 3:03 pm  
Posted by: QuadX

I have 15″ MBPtb with RP460 | Razer Core | GTX 1080. I did TB3 enabler and automate-eGPU script. It detected the GTX1080 and installed 378 webdriver. I reboot after running the script and it’s not detecting the GPU. What am I doing wrong?

Hey guys, my mantiz is arriving next week. I’ll pair it with a 2017 MBP.  What’s the difference exactly between automate-eGPU script and tb3 enabler script? Do I have to run both?

mid-2017 15" Macbook Pro RP555 + GTX1080i@32Gbps-TB3 (Mantiz Venus) + macOS & Win10


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theitsage
(@itsage)
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July 25, 2017 3:10 pm  

@Rycco tb3-enabler script is a workaround for Thunderbolt 3 enclosures with the older TI82 controller to communicate with macOS. The Mantiz Venus has the TI83 controller and is fully compatible with macOS. You do not need to use tb3-enabler script.

Once your Mac establishes communication with a Thunderbolt enclosure, automate-eGPU script facilitates eGPU recognition and driver installation so that external graphics can work in macOS.

macOS High Sierra 10.13 has external graphics support and therefore automate-eGPU script should not be used. Goalque wrote and tested it for 10.9 to 10.12 only.

Edited: 7 months  ago

Numerous implementation guides


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BMW2017
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September 5, 2017 5:31 pm  

Am I correct, that if you use the Radeon Vega RX 64 you don’t need to run scripts with a Mantiz? Only if you go the GTX route?


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