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Apple is supporting external GPUs with High Sierra // US$599 Apple Dev Kit
 

Apple is supporting external GPUs with High Sierra // US$599 Apple Dev Kit  

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goalque
(@goalque)
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@igerard, no problem.

https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/wwdc2017/603/

The key for eGPU support is "removable property" if Apple allows this feature for Nvidia web driver developers.

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jonwatso
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Just noticed that we have native eGPU support in recovery/ booting from a USB installer for 10.13. 

2017 15" MacBook Pro RP560 i7 3.1Ghz - 16GB RAM
Akitio Node + Sapphire RX480 8GB (Reference Card)
Dell 4K DELL P2715Q Display


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High Sir
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Posted by: jonwatso

  http://i.imgur.com/rjX9Vh0.jp

Just noticed that we have native eGPU support in recovery/ booting from a USB installer for 10.13. 

Yes.

Pretty handy for headless Macs (Mini, Pro), no switching cables during macOS installations or maintenance.

I'm guessing this will 99% never work with nvidia, right? Unless Apple implement some really basic nvidia support in the installer. Or full native nvidia support after the 2018 MacPro is out.

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itsage
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@jonwatso did you see the boot screen (Apple logo and loading bar) through the eGPU and monitor?

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jonwatso
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@itsage it goes gray but doesn't show the loading bar. Looks like it's just detected as a secondary display.When I plugged the eGPU in the first time with recovery booted it reloaded recovery before having display output. 

2017 15" MacBook Pro RP560 i7 3.1Ghz - 16GB RAM
Akitio Node + Sapphire RX480 8GB (Reference Card)
Dell 4K DELL P2715Q Display


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techyowl
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I have a early 2015 13" MacBook Pro with intel hd iGPU and I have a developer account so ordered a AMD RX580 which let's just say it's the worst time to buy one of those cards at the moment given the mining craze. I thought I would try Goalque's automate-eGPU.sh script on 10.12.5 since it said AMD support. I couldn't get it to work at all. If it matters I ran it with the uninstall flag first since I was using it with a nvidia GTX 1070 card. I have the card hooked up using an Akitio Node enclosure and I am using a thunderbolt 3-2 adapater and a thunderbolt 2 cable from Apple. I ran through the detailed steps and it would start my MacBook with the Apple logo on my MacBook and it seemed to boot up a little slower first boot and never output anything to my display port monitor. I'm hoping there is a solution to this for 10.12.5 since I really want to use this card before spring of 2018. I then decided to check that the card works under 10.13 high sierra beta and it started right up no issues and seems to work perfectly except I still need to use fcpx and it just crashes on open due to the beta software. Good news is it will work great in spring. I just wish I could get my Mac to work with the egpu on 10.12 sierra. if you have any ideas I'm ready to try them. I also saw elsewhere Goalque was working on a codeless Kext for AMD I am looking forward to that if possible. 

early-2015 13" MBP Retina + RX580@16Gbps-TB2 (AKiTiO Node via TB3->TB2 adapter)


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jonwatso
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Posted by: techyowl

I have a early 2015 13" MacBook Pro with intel hd iGPU and I have a developer account so ordered a AMD RX580 which let's just say it's the worst time to buy one of those cards at the moment given the mining craze. I thought I would try Goalque's automate-eGPU.sh script on 10.12.5 since it said AMD support. I couldn't get it to work at all. If it matters I ran it with the uninstall flag first since I was using it with a nvidia GTX 1070 card. I have the card hooked up using an Akitio Node enclosure and I am using a thunderbolt 3-2 adapater and a thunderbolt 2 cable from Apple. I ran through the detailed steps and it would start my MacBook with the Apple logo on my MacBook and it seemed to boot up a little slower first boot and never output anything to my display port monitor. I'm hoping there is a solution to this for 10.12.5 since I really want to use this card before spring of 2018. I then decided to check that the card works under 10.13 high sierra beta and it started right up no issues and seems to work perfectly except I still need to use fcpx and it just crashes on open due to the beta software. Good news is it will work great in spring. I just wish I could get my Mac to work with the egpu on 10.12 sierra. if you have any ideas I'm ready to try them. I also saw elsewhere Goalque was working on a codeless Kext for AMD I am looking forward to that if possible. 

I'd recommend checking out my implementation guide. You can get final cut to work by removing driver files which is in this guide. 

2017 15" MacBook Pro RP560 i7 3.1Ghz - 16GB RAM
Akitio Node + Sapphire RX480 8GB (Reference Card)
Dell 4K DELL P2715Q Display


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Baldrake
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So what do you guys think happens in October when High Sierra is released? Do you think they remove eGPU functionality until it's done in Spring 2008? Or do they leave it in as a beta feature so developers can get work done?

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Daradain
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I've been a Mac guy for ages and use an iMac now, and I gotta say this is the best news ever! I love the idea of quickly and easily upgrading a mac for better workload, animation, gaming, etc. The future of computing is bright

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ikir
 ikir
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Posted by: Baldrake

So what do you guys think happens in October when High Sierra is released? Do you think they remove eGPU functionality until it's done in Spring 2008? Or do they leave it in as a beta feature so developers can get work done?

Imho it will be included in the next betas.


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my awesome Radeon VII eGPU
my Mantiz Venus extreme mod with Sapphire Nitro+ RX Vega 64


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Menneisyys
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Posted by: oldtimer

Doesnt work for me either...

Specs:

Result: Detects eGPU, login/logout with garbled screen on external monitor

 

Yup, it seems early 2013 MBP's aren't supported at all. I have the i7 / 2.4 GHz / 650M variant and am having exactly the same issues as you when both re-logging in and booting in with the eGPU (Node + Sapphire RX 480 4GB) connected.

Exactly the same eGPU config is working just fine in both booting / hot plugging scenario with a 2015 15" MBP with Iris and i7 + 2.2 GHz. On that system, it works just fine.

On the 2015 MBP, Heaven's benchmarks are in Extreme HD mode: 35.3 fps with the eGPU and 8.0 fps with the Iris Pro, the latter driving the built-in screen.

XCOM 2 auto-detects medium gfx settings and, with them, is absolutely OK  - significantly better than on the TB1-only early 2013 MBP, under 10.12.3.

 

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oldtimer
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Posted by: Menneisyys
Posted by: oldtimer

Doesnt work for me either...

Specs:

Result: Detects eGPU, login/logout with garbled screen on external monitor

 

Yup, it seems early 2013 MBP's aren't supported at all. I have the i7 / 2.4 GHz / 650M variant and am having exactly the same issues as you when both re-logging in and booting in with the eGPU (Node + Sapphire RX 480 4GB) connected.

Exactly the same eGPU config is working just fine in both booting / hot plugging scenario with a 2015 15" MBP with Iris and i7 + 2.2 GHz. On that system, it works just fine.

On the 2015 MBP, Heaven's benchmarks are in Extreme HD mode: 35.3 fps with the eGPU and 8.0 fps with the Iris Pro, the latter driving the built-in screen.

XCOM 2 auto-detects medium gfx settings and, with them, is absolutely OK  - significantly better than on the TB1-only early 2013 MBP, under 10.12.3.

 

Thanks for confirming, I thought it might have been something with my setup.

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goalque
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Posted by: Menneisyys
On the 2015 MBP, Heaven's benchmarks are in Extreme HD mode: 35.3 fps with the eGPU and 8.0 fps with the Iris Pro, the latter driving the built-in screen. 

We should start looking at Metal numbers.

https://egpu.io/forums/mac-setup/metal-api-shines-rx-480-reaches-60fps-on-macos-10-12-4-fhd-ultra-high-settings/

automate-eGPU EFIapple_set_os.efi
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Baldrake
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So looking for advice. I want to get an eGPU. I only have one computer so can't afford to run beta software between now and next spring.

I'm kind of thinking the safe approach is to get a third party eGPU with an RX580 and run it under Sierra, with the thought that I know it will run when eGPU support goes official in roughly one year.

Would that make any sense?

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goalque
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Menneisyys
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Posted by: Baldrake

I only have one computer so can't afford to run beta software between now and next spring.

Why don't you get an external USB drive strictly for experimenting with High Sierra? That's what I do - while my main MBP stays at 10.12.3 (or soon 10.12.4, if my hacking the AMD kexts is successful in keeping my Node + RX480 working.) Even a non-SSD hard disk would do and even via USB2 only - currently that's what I'm using (but already ordered the latest-and-greatest USB 3.1 enclosure, of course).

This way, strictly if you stick with AMD (there being no High Sierra drivers for Nvidia cards), you could use your rig under both OS'es; 10.12.4 being your normal go-to OS you generally use.

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mac_editor
(@mac_editor)
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@Menneisyys: I have a Node + 480 combo as well which works perfectly fine without kext modifications using automate-eGPU.sh 1.0.1 on macOS 10.12.5. The updated script includes compatibility for the the missing device ID for the RX 470/480 on macOS 10.12.4 or later (pre-High Sierra of course).

Also, I second your suggestion of using an external drive - that's what I will do soon to test on High Sierra.

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rmvz3
(@rmvz3)
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Wow. I've just tried to buy the dev kit but turns out that once I press the "Buy" button the $599 became €889 (that's more than $995!!) Free shipping tho…

C'mon Apple….

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thor203
(@thor203)
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Hello together

I have a MBP 13" mid 2012.Does the Sonnet Breakaway Box work with a Thunderbolt 3 to Thunderbolt 2 Adapter under Windows 10 (Bootcamp)? 

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jonwatso
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Posted by: goalque
Posted by: Menneisyys
On the 2015 MBP, Heaven's benchmarks are in Extreme HD mode: 35.3 fps with the eGPU and 8.0 fps with the Iris Pro, the latter driving the built-in screen. 

We should start looking at Metal numbers.

https://egpu.io/forums/mac-setup/metal-api-shines-rx-480-reaches-60fps-on-macos-10-12-4-fhd-ultra-high-settings/

Would love to see benchmark numbers from an benchmark application utilising metal 2 with proper eGPU support.

2017 15" MacBook Pro RP560 i7 3.1Ghz - 16GB RAM
Akitio Node + Sapphire RX480 8GB (Reference Card)
Dell 4K DELL P2715Q Display


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torncanvas
(@torncanvas)
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Posted by: Baldrake

the safe approach is to get a third party eGPU with an RX580

Would that make any sense?

Provided you want to start now, the only part that doesn't make sense is "get an RX580". Stock for the mid-level AMD cards is out around the world due to cryptocurrency miners. I called CDW and the guy I talked to said it would be August before they got more. I could see Amazon getting stock first, but they may only beat CDW by a week or two.

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robzr
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According to Sonnet's specs, the 350w version of the Breakaway box supports only 15w upstream power (USB-PD).  Apple's published notes state that the dev kit 350w unit will provide up to 60w.  Is Apple selling a different version or are Sonnet's published specs old/incomplete?

Rob

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itsage
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Posted by: robzr

According to Sonnet’s specs, the 350w version of the Breakaway box supports only 15w upstream power (USB-PD).  Apple’s published notes state that the dev kit 350w unit will provide up to 60w.  Is Apple selling a different version or are Sonnet’s published specs old/incomplete?

Rob

The Sonnet Breakaway in Apple Dev Kit has a different Thunderbolt firmware (25.1) than the one in regular 350W unit (25.2). It has 60W PD (regular 350W has 15W) and only one 8-pin PCIe power cable (the 6-pin cable is in there but shrink-wrapped).

Best ultrabooks for eGPU use | eGPU enclosure buying guide


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rawweb
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Posted by: torncanvas

Provided you want to start now, the only part that doesn't make sense is "get an RX580". Stock for the mid-level AMD cards is out around the world due to cryptocurrency miners. I called CDW and the guy I talked to said it would be August before they got more. I could see Amazon getting stock first, but they may only beat CDW by a week or two.

 

No doubt, been trying to get my hands on either a 480 or 580 for weeks. It's not looking promising...

A message to newegg suggests that may not even see more stock.

2017 15" MacBook Pro + 16GB + Radeon Pro 560
2013 Mac Pro
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itsage
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I checked around and RX 470 as well as RX 570 are no where to be found. The local Micro Center store has now implemented a two-GPU per household limit. This feels like a gold rush. 😀

Best ultrabooks for eGPU use | eGPU enclosure buying guide


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torncanvas
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Buying from Apple is not a bad plan. In fact, I have a sinking feeling either miners or savvy eBay sellers are going to catch on eventually, too. One could easily make a $100 profit on reselling the individual parts.

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subtledoctor
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REALLY annoyed that they are not supporting the monitors that Apple has actually been selling through their site for the last ~5 years (Apple Thunderbolt Display and LG Thunderbolt 3 Display).  I spent almost a thousand bucks on that thing so that I could get the benefit of Thunderbolt - it was billed as a good display plus extra functionality; not as something that is less capable than a cheaper, older HDMI/DisplayPort/DVI display.  Replacing it is not in the cards and depreciation has destroyed most of its value.  I really hope that they are supported at some point...

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Baldrake
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All we've seen from Apple so far is a Dev kit. If they ever release their own eGPU as a product (and that's a big if), they may well support thunderbolt displays.

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ikir
 ikir
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Posted by: subtledoctor

REALLY annoyed that they are not supporting the monitors that Apple has actually been selling through their site for the last ~5 years (Apple Thunderbolt Display and LG Thunderbolt 3 Display).  I spent almost a thousand bucks on that thing so that I could get the benefit of Thunderbolt - it was billed as a good display plus extra functionality; not as something that is less capable than a cheaper, older HDMI/DisplayPort/DVI display.  Replacing it is not in the cards and depreciation has destroyed most of its value.  I really hope that they are supported at some point...

GPU doesn't have Thundebolt. They probably will support them but you will lose performance like internal display. Anyway even now you can use eGPU for OpenCL and METAL calculations.


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techyowl
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I downloading a free program call ResExtreme and I applied an 8 bit as opposed to a 10 bit resolution to my external 4k monitor that is connected to the EGPU in 10.13 High Sierra beta. Now it stopped the complete crashing however I was having some weird beach balls that I had to force quit FCPX. I was able to get proxy media loaded up from my library on my 10.12.5 partition and then I was able to edit through 45 minutes of 360 4k 24hz footage from a Gear 360 2017 camera without any lagging. Very nice once FCPX was ready. It rendering a 7 minute video and its still going after 30 minutes so not super fast there but this is beta software so could see it run faster later. its currently at 65%

early-2015 13" MBP Retina + RX580@16Gbps-TB2 (AKiTiO Node via TB3->TB2 adapter)


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JonnieCache
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Posted by: subtledoctor

REALLY annoyed that they are not supporting the monitors that Apple has actually been selling through their site for the last ~5 years (Apple Thunderbolt Display and LG Thunderbolt 3 Display).  I spent almost a thousand bucks on that thing so that I could get the benefit of Thunderbolt - it was billed as a good display plus extra functionality; not as something that is less capable than a cheaper, older HDMI/DisplayPort/DVI display.  Replacing it is not in the cards and depreciation has destroyed most of its value.  I really hope that they are supported at some point...

The release notes seem to indicate that it WILL be included in the future...

 

The External Graphics Development Kit is designed to support one VR headset and/or one external monitor. The VR headset supported by the kit is the HTC Vive. External monitors with HDMI or DisplayPort are supported. Thunderbolt or USB-C displays are not supported at this time.

macOS High Sierra Developer Beta

When using the External Graphics Development Kit with macOS 10.13 beta (17A264c), the following additional restrictions apply:

  • Mirroring to a display attached the the External Graphics Developer Kit is not yet supported; please use extended display mode.

  • “Closed-Clamshell” mode is not yet supported.

  • HDMI audio is not yet supported on the External Graphics Development Kit HDMI ports

  • AutoLogin will not work if the External Graphics Development Kit is attached at the time the system is booted / restarted.

  • Hot-plug and un-plug of the External Graphics Development Kit require returning to the Login screen.

  • The External Graphics Development Kit does not accelerate the internal display on iMac or MacBook Pro.

  • The External Graphics Development Kit prevents the Mac from entering sleep mode. Display sleep is still available. 

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Trajans Row
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Posted by: subtledoctor

REALLY annoyed that they are not supporting the monitors that Apple has actually been selling through their site for the last ~5 years (Apple Thunderbolt Display and LG Thunderbolt 3 Display).  I spent almost a thousand bucks on that thing so that I could get the benefit of Thunderbolt - it was billed as a good display plus extra functionality; not as something that is less capable than a cheaper, older HDMI/DisplayPort/DVI display.  Replacing it is not in the cards and depreciation has destroyed most of its value.  I really hope that they are supported at some point...

I believe the hardware is capable of an eGPU driving a thunderbolt display. In Windows, I can use my Razer Core to output to my Apple Thunderbolt Display through another TB3 port. I can play Battlefield 1 at max settings this way. You just have to connect everything in exactly the right order, otherwise you will bluescreen. 

 
The question is when/if Apple will make the software portion work on macOS. 

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Menneisyys
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Posted by: techyowl

I was able to edit through 45 minutes of 360 4k 24hz footage from a Gear 360 2017 camera without any lagging

Just an offtopic question: do you have overheating problem with the new Gear 360? The old one wasn't able to record more than 20 minutes in 4k30 or 2.8k30. It's only capable of infinite recording in 2.5k30. Has this been fixed in the new model (preferably in 4k30, but 4k24 would also be OK)?

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robzr
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Posted by: itsage
Posted by: robzr

According to Sonnet's specs, the 350w version of the Breakaway box supports only 15w upstream power (USB-PD).  Apple's published notes state that the dev kit 350w unit will provide up to 60w.  Is Apple selling a different version or are Sonnet's published specs old/incomplete?

Rob

The Sonnet Breakaway in Apple Dev Kit has a different Thunderbolt firmware (25.1) than the one in regular 350W unit (25.2). It has 60W PD and only one 8-pin PCIe power cable (the 6-pin cable is in there but shrink-wrapped).

I just got my eGFX dev kit today, the Sonnet chassis is lower quality than I expected.  Like, bottom rung cheap computer chassis quality complete with poorly aligned and threaded holes in the stamped steel.

 The power supply is an Akasa AK-PS035AF01 which appears to be an OEM part.  Looks like it's SFX and there is plenty of room to swap in a larger unit, at least physically.  The logic board header is ATX.  4-pin PWM fan also from Akasa, 12w brushless 120mm. 

If the PSU were raised 2-3 inches, the chassis could be an ITX chassis.  It's big.  Looks like there is room for a 13"+ GPU. 

So the RX 580 draws peak ~230w; 60W for USB, plus whatever the board an PSU draw/lose.  Probably not a ton of headroom with that PSU, which explains the capped off 6-pin.

I wonder if the difference is a jumper or firmware for the USB PD difference.  60w is probably perfect for charging (or at least maintaining) an a 15" MBP while using this setup.  Really happy to see Apple finally getting serious about GPU, and I hope this bleeds down into gaming software.

Time to install some betas.....

Rob

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vertice
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Posted by: techyowl

I have a early 2015 13" MacBook Pro with intel hd iGPU and I have a developer account so ordered a AMD RX580 which let's just say it's the worst time to buy one of those cards at the moment given the mining craze. I thought I would try Goalque's automate-eGPU.sh script on 10.12.5 since it said AMD support. I couldn't get it to work at all. If it matters I ran it with the uninstall flag first since I was using it with a nvidia GTX 1070 card. I have the card hooked up using an Akitio Node enclosure and I am using a thunderbolt 3-2 adapater and a thunderbolt 2 cable from Apple. I ran through the detailed steps and it would start my MacBook with the Apple logo on my MacBook and it seemed to boot up a little slower first boot and never output anything to my display port monitor. I'm hoping there is a solution to this for 10.12.5 since I really want to use this card before spring of 2018. I then decided to check that the card works under 10.13 high sierra beta and it started right up no issues and seems to work perfectly except I still need to use fcpx and it just crashes on open due to the beta software. Good news is it will work great in spring. I just wish I could get my Mac to work with the egpu on 10.12 sierra. if you have any ideas I'm ready to try them. I also saw elsewhere Goalque was working on a codeless Kext for AMD I am looking forward to that if possible. 

I got it to work, but the refresh rate was about 1fps. Definitely not working right. Another member here had the same experience with that setup as well.

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jonwatso
(@jonwatso)
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Posted by: Menneisyys
Posted by: oldtimer

Doesnt work for me either...

Specs:

Result: Detects eGPU, login/logout with garbled screen on external monitor

 

Yup, it seems early 2013 MBP's aren't supported at all. I have the i7 / 2.4 GHz / 650M variant and am having exactly the same issues as you when both re-logging in and booting in with the eGPU (Node + Sapphire RX 480 4GB) connected.

Exactly the same eGPU config is working just fine in both booting / hot plugging scenario with a 2015 15" MBP with Iris and i7 + 2.2 GHz. On that system, it works just fine.

On the 2015 MBP, Heaven's benchmarks are in Extreme HD mode: 35.3 fps with the eGPU and 8.0 fps with the Iris Pro, the latter driving the built-in screen.

XCOM 2 auto-detects medium gfx settings and, with them, is absolutely OK  - significantly better than on the TB1-only early 2013 MBP, under 10.12.3.

 

2017 15" MacBook Pro RP560 i7 3.1Ghz - 16GB RAM
Akitio Node + Sapphire RX480 8GB (Reference Card)
Dell 4K DELL P2715Q Display


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