ALERT: half H2D performance issue on TI83 TB3 enclosures (Node, Venus, Devil Box...
 
Notifications
Clear all

ALERT: half H2D performance issue on TI83 TB3 enclosures (Node, Venus, Devil Box, XG Station 2)  

 of  29
  RSS

ddqp
 ddqp
(@ddqp)
Eminent Member
Joined: 3 years ago
 

you have TB3 enclosure with limited bandwidth caused by intel, connected to TB3 computer, and your measurement show no difference with TB3 no limited enclosure;

what about if you plug TB2 enclosure on TB3 computer, then the restriction will be TB2 enclosure, if it shows the same result(game fps, benchmark, etc) with TB3 enclosure, then it means, TB3 enclosure is no meanings.

Late Macbook Pro 2016 13' touch bar + AKITIO node + GTX 1050TI 4G Windows


ReplyQuote
Mymantiz_John
(@mymantiz_john)
Vendor
Joined: 3 years ago
 
Posted by: ddqp

 

you have TB3 enclosure with limited bandwidth caused by intel, connected to TB3 computer, and your measurement show no different with TB3 no limited enclosure;

what about if you plug TB2 enclosure on TB3 computer, then the restriction will be TB2 enclosure, if it show the same result(game fps, benchmark, etc) with TB3, then it means, TB3 enclosure is no meanings.

   

I hope I could have one TB2 box  in my county. is there anybody who had tested MBP2016 late + NV1080 in 3Dmark + TB2 Box? 

Mantiz: ● ●


ReplyQuote
wimpzilla
(@wimpzilla)
Honorable Member
Joined: 3 years ago
 

I completely agree  with your engineering point of view about the firmware choice. But like @ddqp said, picking the heart of the issue, whats is the meaning to provide a potential 4x pci express bandwidth, but restrict it depending witch hardware you would use, witch weight it have among the pro/customer market.

I'm sure where it is really needed, worth, custom firmware and maybe expensive TBE driver could perform hotplug and high bandwidth without any problem.

That said, the main issue and advert for an adapter like these, it is to be plug and play like you said, but also be capable of reliable performance with high end video adapters, witch mean in any way a good pci-e link, bandwidth, response time.

You can try yourself to play on 1080p/1440p/4K and record the frametime along the usual fps count. If you didn't see any substantial drops, stutters, you are good to go. 

2012 13-inch Dell Latitude E6320 + R9 [email protected] (EXP GDC 8.4) + Win10
E=Mc²

 
2012 15" Lenovo Thinkpad T530 [2nd,4C,Q] + R9 270X @ 4Gbps-mPCIe2 (EXP GDC 8.4) + Win10 [build link]  


ReplyQuote
Mymantiz_John
(@mymantiz_john)
Vendor
Joined: 3 years ago
 
Posted by: wimpzilla

 

I completely agree  with your engineering point of view about the firmware choice. But like @ddqp said, picking the heart of the issue, whats is the meaning to provide a potential 4x pci express bandwidth, but restrict it depending witch hardware you would use, witch weight it have among the pro/customer market.

I'm sure where it is really needed, worth, custom firmware and maybe expensive TBE driver could perform hotplug and high bandwidth without any problem.

That said, the main issue and advert for an adapter like these, it is to be plug and play like you said, but also be capable of reliable performance with high end video adapters, witch mean in any way a good pci-e link, bandwidth, response time.

You can try yourself to play on 1080p/1440p/4K and record the frametime along the usual fps count. If you didn't see any substantial drops, stutters, you are good to go. 

   

Thanks for your advises, I'll prepare those material to have deeper test.

HOw many min playback & record by your suggestion? and what will be the difference if I use the Unigine Heaven or Valley to run the test? They are mainly for the FPS right? Teach me more about this, thanks.

 

 

 

Mantiz: ● ●


ReplyQuote
wimpzilla
(@wimpzilla)
Honorable Member
Joined: 3 years ago
 

If you want to build up a nice review, data, you could use further, i suggest you to use the basic video adapters review guides lines, used to review the hardware in top tech sites.

Obviously your aim is not to do such big review with a lot of games. Only a few heavy games that have built in benchmark, usually repeating the test 2/3 time minimum to get consistent data to work with. Recording frametime and focusing on minimum fps reflect a smooth and enjoyable video experience, since here you are benchmarking the box, not different cards, so only the TBE2 or TBE3 should be the limiting factor.

You can include benchmarks, but remember if your aim is to gathers consistent, reliable data, to get a conclusion, you should primary focus on game experience, benchmark not always reflect the ingame optimizations and load, especially in latest games.

 

 

2012 13-inch Dell Latitude E6320 + R9 [email protected] (EXP GDC 8.4) + Win10
E=Mc²

 
2012 15" Lenovo Thinkpad T530 [2nd,4C,Q] + R9 270X @ 4Gbps-mPCIe2 (EXP GDC 8.4) + Win10 [build link]  


ReplyQuote
Mymantiz_John
(@mymantiz_john)
Vendor
Joined: 3 years ago
 
Posted by: wimpzilla

 

If you want to build up a nice review, data, you could use further, i suggest you to use the basic video adapters review guides lines, used to review the hardware in top tech sites.

Obviously your aim is not to do such big review with a lot of games. Only a few heavy games that have built in benchmark, usually repeating the test 2/3 time minimum to get consistent data to work with. Recording frametime and focusing on minimum fps reflect a smooth and enjoyable video experience, since here you are benchmarking the box, not different cards, so only the TBE2 or TBE3 should be the limiting factor.

You can include benchmarks, but remember if your aim is to gathers consistent, reliable data, to get a conclusion, you should primary focus on game experience, benchmark not always reflect the ingame optimizations and load, especially in latest games.

 

 

   

unfortunately I could have TB3 box but with two versions FW 2200mb & 1100mb, it is hard to get the TB2 box here. I'll try to get one, once it is done, I'll post again. 

but basically, impossible the performance is poor than the tb2 box, and more over, tb3 support much more than the tb2. even the worst case TB3( No matter 2200mb or 1100 mb ) is so similar with TB2 performance , but still to purchase TB3 box is much worthy than tB2's according to the larger  bandwidth ( PCIe  22gb data + others ) , Power delivery & Hot Plug & Play. and also need to think about the latest Laptop design changed to the tb3 type C port and no more Mini DP for TB2. 

this should be no argument  in purchase guideline point of view.

 

 

Mantiz: ● ●


ReplyQuote
Jaye
 Jaye
(@jaye)
Eminent Member
Joined: 3 years ago
 

I'm kinda confused.. Akitio reported here that they've got an updated FW from Intel that fixes the issue, right? I'm correct? 

On the other side, Mr. Mymantiz_John said different things and there is no any confirmation about FW fix from Intel.

I will be thankful if someone would clarify this information for me.

2017 13" HP Spectre 13" x360 + [email protected] (AKiTiO Node) + Win10

 
2016 13" HP Spectre X360 [7th,2C,U] + GTX 1080 Ti @ 32Gbps-TB3 (AKiTiO Node) + Win10 [build link]  


ReplyQuote
Mymantiz_John
(@mymantiz_john)
Vendor
Joined: 3 years ago
 
Posted by: Jaye

 

I'm kinda confused.. Akitio reported here that they've got an updated FW from Intel that fixes the issue, right? I'm correct? 

On the other side, Mr. Mymantiz_John said different things and there is no any confirmation about FW fix from Intel.

I will be thankful if someone would clarify this information for me.

   

For an eGPU FW, currently there's no update. and the value from Cuda Z & Matlab had been reported to Intel. and again, I have both versions and still not able to see any significant difference in performance based on my Test. the value is  only half , why the performance  in benchmark & games are that difficult and invisible to be seen?  

I had also send 2 PCBA with different FW to the profession lab to measure the H2D PCIe Bandwidth, I'll have result soon.

 

 

Mantiz: ● ●


Jaye, itsage and nando4 liked
ReplyQuote
Jaye
 Jaye
(@jaye)
Eminent Member
Joined: 3 years ago
 

Okay, from my experience with this issue:

My Laptop: ASUS UX501VW (i7 -6700HQ) - should be enough of CPU power for anything. 

Please check my screenshots.

Internal Display (Akitio Node + STRIX 1070)

External Display(Same hardware)


 

There is obvious fps difference on external display, but I believe that even external display should perform better, no?

There are results of desktop with gtx 1070 on internet showing 200 (max value) fps in the same benchmark: 

I know that there is slowdown comparing to desktop performance, but should it be that big? 

 

Anyway, even if those are totally correct results, I think I have one of cases when H2D bandwidth matters:

I'm running World of Warcraft Legion with 1920x1080, Ultra settings, distance setting is 7 (out of 10 possible) - getting 60 fps. When I'm changing distance value to 8+ (up to 10) - fps is 40-45. (various YouTube videos show 60+ fps still). I don't think that this slowdown is related to TB3 slower speeds, but to overall bandwidth available. In my opinion, slowdowns are based not on complexity of visual effects\particles\etc, but on overall data speed available. 

Another case with WoW Legion: When I'm suddenly changing camera's direction (totally new scene on display) - slowdown happens. CPU? I don't think so, I don't have this issue with internal 960M. 

I hope my info will help with this issue.

 

2017 13" HP Spectre 13" x360 + [email protected] (AKiTiO Node) + Win10

 
2016 13" HP Spectre X360 [7th,2C,U] + GTX 1080 Ti @ 32Gbps-TB3 (AKiTiO Node) + Win10 [build link]  


ReplyQuote
goalque
(@goalque)
Noble Member Admin
Joined: 4 years ago
 
Posted by: DanKnight

 

Update March 29, 2017:

Intel has responded to us with a beta firmware. We're currently running tests for stability and seeing if it comes with any other issues. Intel has also reached out to the other companies as well (according to them).

   

But isn’t the Node also eGFX certified?

I was thinking, if the H2D bandwidth goes through DP protocol lanes and therefore PCIe DATA bandwidth reduction is not visible in gaming?

Notice the single-precision GPU core performance: 9114Gflops/s vs 5047Gflops/s (A Dell Precision M7510 - TI82 Razer Core vs TI83 AKiTiO Node).

On the other hand, ~500MiB/s H2D difference between the Node & Devil Box (TI82) did not make any difference in CUDA-Z's GPU core performance numbers. I will conduct some more research.

 

automate-eGPU EFIapple_set_os.efi

Mid 2015 15-inch MacBook Pro eGPU Master Thread

 
2018 13" MacBook Pro [8th,4C,U] + Radeon VII @ 32Gbps-TB3 (ASUS XG Station Pro) + Win10 1809 [build link]  


ReplyQuote
 of  29